File No. 9110137
WORLD TRADE CENTER
TASK FORCE INTERVIEW
DEPUTY CHIEF CHARLES R. BLAICH
Interview Date: October 23, 2001
Transcribed by Elisabeth F. Nason
MR. CASTORINA: The time is 0910 hours. We
are conducting an interview. We are at the World
Trade Center Task Force on Duane Street. I'm Ron
Castorina.
MR. McCOURT: I'm Tom McCourt.
MR. CASTORINA: Sir, your name and your
title.
DEPUTY CHIEF BLAICH: Charles R. Blaich,
Deputy Chief.
Q. Chief, can you tell me on September 11, 2001
the events that took place that day.
A. Yes.[Sentence blacked out D.C] . I received a call from my
brother that the World Trade Center was burning. His
wife drove both of us to the ferry, Staten Island
Ferry. We live on Staten Island obviously. And we got
a boat that departed approximately 0930 hours in the
morning. On board that boat were various police
detachments and vehicles and a number of volunteer
firefighters taking the boat over to volunteer.
At some time off the Battery, off the
Whitehall ferry terminal, the first tower collapsed and
then it appeared after that the second one collapsed
and in between that time frame, the boat finally got into the slip. We worked our way off the boat. My
brother went to the east side to try to work his way up
Broadway to get to the Duane Street fire house to get
his gear.
Q. Who is your brother?
A. William.
Q. William Blaich?
A. I worked to the west side with the people
from Staten Island who had volunteered. We stopped for
a few minutes. There was a traffic supervisor that
kind of directed us through the subway at Whitehall
Street to see if we could work our way up north that
way and there were just too many non-answers. We
decided to proceed to the west away from in the dust
cloud as much as we could. We worked our way up around
the Battery.
In that route, we bumped into -- the first
Fire Department activity we bumped into was a mobile
command post, which was -- apparently had just come out
of the Battery Tunnel and was trying to set up, I guess
Battery Park Plaza there, that street just north of the
Battery.
I went on board that vehicle and received a
radio, tried to find out what was going on. There was really little or no information. I got my volunteers
together. We had a contractor giving us an assortment
of shovels and picks and whatever and we proceeded
further up to the west. I bumped into Dr. Prezant, who
looked like he had just been put in a bag of flour and
shaken up and down several times. He was very
disoriented, but he was able to give me a little bit of
information of what was going on. We commandeered, or
we asked actually, one of the volunteer ambulances that
were there, gave us some face masks to wear at that
point.
We grabbed a pile of those and proceeded
further north. I eventually arrived at Liberty and
West Street, where basically I was -- Rescue 2, whose
rig was there. There was an engine company behind
Rescue 2, although I don't remember the number of it.
That was on the north side of Liberty Street and on the
south side there was a commercial van of some sort.
I grabbed a Lieutenant Ryan, who I believe
works in the -- he used to work in the Medical Division
and I believe is in Staten Island now. I designated
him as my aide and we attempted to establish a command
post. We were attempting to establish it on top of the
roof of the van. People were coming in asking directions. The scene at that point where there were
numerous fires burning through the pile. We were
tentatively directing the volunteers to start fanning
out on top of the pile to see if we could make any spot
rescues, if anyone was alive.
At the same time we were informed that there
was no water in the hydrant system and what engine
companies we had that were still remaining, they were
back towards the west end of Liberty Street there, I
guess sometimes called the South End Avenue or South
End Street, were reporting they had no water.
At some point during this, the difficult part
was people were trying to make rescues of victims that
they could see in the pile and we had to force them
away because people had I beams through them and things
like that. We just didn't have the time to invest in
bringing out dead bodies. We were trying to find live
bodies. We were getting reports, to the best of my
knowledge, they were caught like that, I believe it was
58 Engine. They were reporting their officer was
missing and they were digging themselves out from Cedar
Street, which is that street just south of the hotel.
And I kept hearing 65 Engine, but I'm not
sure where they fit into this. I never did confirm where they were. We did confirm we had lost the 58
Engine officer, because some of their people came out.
I was informed that we had gotten word that people had
got up and gotten[3 sentences blacked out D.C] My aide, we kept attempting to make a list of where we were putting these casualties.
I know it was at that point that Ladder 131
members were being thrown on a boat and either sent to
the Statue of Liberty or to New Jersey. There were
some ambulance rep there who said we couldn't move
ambulances north or south and the only way out was by
boat.
At some point there, Chief Hayden came on the
scene with basically slits for eyes. I tried to tell
him to go to the ambulance, but he remained on the
scene and we attempted to operate a command post. He
re-established it on the back of the pumper. Kevin
Cully from OEM surfaced at some point. He also looked
like he had been shaken in a bag of flour. Then we
attempted to establish a command post.
At that point a member of the Fire
Department, in a blue uniform, informed me that the fire boat Harvey was on the scene. I stopped in
disbelief, half knowing that the Harvey was sold a
while ago, but he said it was here, had no equipment
and an hour's worth of fuel, so OEM attempted to get
fuel but apparently the fire boat flagged down a
passing oiler and got fuel.
We were able to get a couple of engine
companies back in service and they stretched from the
fire boat. That was our only source of water at that
point. I was also informed at that point that there
was a fire, of all hands proportion broken out in the
south end apartments. All I could dispatch was one
group of firefighters to work on that.
Chief Mosier from Staten Island, 8th
Division, arrived on the scene. This is how we
established the sectors at that point. I looked as far
north as I could see and called that the Liberty Street
sector. I believe Chief Visconti was somewhere on the
other end, on the north side of that pile in the middle
between West -- on West between Liberty and up to where
that bridge had collapsed up further and we said, all
right, you will be the Vesey Street command. At some
point Chief Haring came on the radio and he designated
himself as Church Street command. He had numerous fires going on his side. We had a tower ladder. For
some reason, 15 truck was still in service, but without
water. When the boat finally got the water going, we
hooked up the water to the tower ladder. We stretched
several hand lines, proceeded to search the pile in
even more detail.
Chief Mosier's building now, the twenty
story, number 90 West was becoming fully involved. He
had approximately 40 firemen without any equipment. I
believe Marine One eventually supplied water to him and
that's what he operated. That was a sector, sort of an
adjunct sector to the Liberty command post.
I proceeded to direct operations. At some
point Chief Hayden was removed, I believe to try to get
some sort of first aid. I remained in command until
approximately midnight and I was relieved by another
Deputy Chief, who I relieved the next morning when I
came back and that just sort of flip flopped back and
forth till Friday.
That's basically what I recollect. Somewhere
during the -- time was totally condensed here. I don't
remember exact hours. We received several reports.
One from Ladder 6, reporting talking to Chief Cruthers,
but he was calling Car 4 Charlie and I realized there was no command above the Sector Chiefs at that point so
I answered and asked him what his situation was.
The Captain was reporting that he was trapped
in the B stairway and I said we are noting your
position. What is your situation. He said, well, we
are here. We have a civilian, but did he have any
immediate danger, people crushed. He said no. I said
I have no access to help you. I said I have noted
where you are, as soon as I get some help, we will try
to work on that.
My brother came on the radio at some point.
He was up at Vesey Street, trying to work his way one
way or another into the Trade, probably into a garage
or something. He had, I think, 43 Truck or somebody
with him. I relayed that information. I don't believe
he ever got the 6 Truck. I believe 6 Truck eventually
got themselves out.
The only other report I got was there was
some confusion. They thought my nephew Peter was a
fireman in 9 Engine and located him, and they told me
that.
That's all I have to say, unless you have any
particular questions.
MR. CASTORINA: Okay. The time now is 0920 hours. Thank you, Chief.
File No. 9110302
WORLD TRADE CENTER
TASK FORCE INTERVIEW
FIREFIGHTER RICHARD BOERI
Interview Date: December 10, 2001
Transcribed by Laurie A. Collins
CHIEF KENAHAN: The time is 2:05 p.m.,
and this is Battalion Chief Dennis Kenahan
of the Safety Battalion of the Fire
Department of the City of New York. I'm
conducting an interview with Richard Boeri
of Engine 44.
Q. Richard, just explain in your own words
what happened on September 11th.
A. I was minimum manning that day,
overtime. At 9:08 the call came in. I was
control man. We ended up going out of quarters,
going down Second Avenue down to about 59th
Street, across the West Side Highway and down.
I believe we parked the rig
approximately, I think it was Murray Street or
Barclay and West, and we proceeded to go down to
the command post, which was I believe across from
One World Trade Center or the north tower.
I think we were there for about five
minutes. They said, "Put your gear down. You're
going to walk up about 80 flights of stairs,"
because the elevators were out. So we put our
masks down, rollups and everything.
I think we saw like 18 people jump. Then one of the officers there said, "Turn
around, concentrate on who you can save. You
can't save those people anymore." I don't recall
who that was.
There was a chaplain behind us. It
wasn't Father Judge, but one of the guys knew
him. He said a little prayer for us.
So I went through the guys from there.
I saw the chief's aide, and I talked to him for a
little bit. It had to be about 20 minutes later
when they sent us down to approximately Cedar
Street and West Street. They were there, two or
three rigs blocking the West Side Highway coming
from the south. So we were sent with 53 Engine
to move those rigs out of the way.
Myself, my whole company, Matt Shannon,
Bobby Reeg, the covering officer, and Eddie
Kennedy proceeded to walk down. Looking over, I
saw 65 Engine hooked up to the hotel, I believe,
or the south tower. I don't remember which one
because there's a high pressure pump.
The officer saw there were several
small fires at the foot of the pedestrian bridge
right there at Liberty and West. So our initial thing was myself and Eddie Kennedy would move the
rig away from West Street to let the companies
come up from the south. Also they told us to
bring ambulances up Washington Street, which is
on the south side of the south tower there.
Bobby Reeg, the nozzle man, he was
checking rigs up the West Side Highway for an
extinguisher for the car fire along with Matt
Shannon. So they were looking I guess -- right
in front of the Vista Hotel.
We had our backs to the tower and under
that pedestrian bridge walking south, myself,
Eddie Kennedy and the officer, when you heard the
crackling. You looked up and you saw the one
floor explode on itself and the top start to
slide.
At that point Eddie just told me to
run, and we just dropped everything and ran south
towards Albany Street. Now, we ran I guess on
the east side of West Side Highway -- we ran
across to -- the east side, we ran to the west
side of that highway, down towards Albany.
At the southwest corner there were a
few parked cars. I saw Eddie Kennedy lose his helmet and dive under a car. I saw a building --
I believe it's at the corner of West and
Albany -- and I was going to try to go for the
building.
Once all the debris and everything
caught up, I was pushed over a four foot fence.
The next thing, I woke up, I was spitting
everything out of my mouth, and it was just
black, silent.
When I came to, I heard a civilian
yelling on my left. So I found my helmet next to
me, picked myself up. I found the civilian, who
was over by the building. Make it Park Place, I
guess? I can't tell what building that is.
Anyway, it's right on Albany and West Street.
So I walked the civilian back. I
walked back to where my company was. Where I
last knew, Albany and West, where I found the
officer and Eddie Kennedy. I passed the civilian
off to someone else who was there.
I was with Eddie Kennedy and the
officer when Dr. Kelly showed up, her and another
guy I believe from 4 Truck, I want to say. I'm
not sure. I had cut my head. My whole face was full of blood. I was talking to them. I was
okay.
We were trying to radio Matt Shannon,
who was our backup man. He had the radio. He
said he knew where Bobby Reeg was, because Matt
was just going for the river up by the marina
there.
Dr. Kelly said, "Come with me. We'll
wash you up. You're hurt." So I told the
officer I'm going with him, which we proceeded to
go to Albany Street, I guess, half a block to a
parking garage, which is in the Hudson View West,
in the Hudson Tower here.
In there they had a guy on the back
board, Kevin Shea, who I guess he was hurt before
the collapse because there was something -- they
had him on a back board and everything.
I was there when they went to try to
find a gurney or stretcher to get him to an
ambulance, because they told us the whole
southern section you couldn't get to an ambulance
or anything.
I was there for a while with him, when
you heard the rumbling again. That's when the north tower came down. We stayed in the garage.
There was another chief there. He covered Kevin
Shea when all the dust came into the whole
garage, all the debris and everything, all the
dust didn't get into his spot because he was all
strapped down. He had a dislocated hip or
something. He kept repeating the same questions
about 15 times over and over.
We knew we had to get him out. We got
to 4 Truck on I guess it was West End Avenue over
here one block west of West Side Highway. They
got an ambulance, which we threw him in the
ambulance and we drove straight toward West
Street.
(Interruption.)
A. So we got the ambulance, and we drove
straight west on Albany Street all the way to the
river. We broke through the chain fence on the
esplanade there where the police boat pulled up.
At that point is where we proceeded to hand Kevin
over on the back board over the side railing and
into a police boat.
A few minutes later I ended up going on
a police boat also across to Jersey to Hoboken, where I was there until about 11:00 at night
because they wouldn't let us back. While we were
there, we made phone calls back and found out
where everybody was from our point of view.
In general that's it.
Q. Thank you very much, Rich.
CHIEF KENAHAN: The time now is 2:12,
and this concludes the interview.
File No. 9110426
WORLD TRADE CENTER
TASK FORCE INTERVIEW
FIREFIGHTER NICHOLAS BORRILLO
Interview Date: January 9, 2002
Transcribed by Laurie A. Collins
CHIEF CONGIUSTA: Today's date is
January 9, 2002. The time is 1300 hours.
This is Battalion Chief Frank Congiusta of
the Safety Division of the Fire Department
of the City of New York. I'm conducting an
interview with the following individual --
FIREFIGHTER BORRILLO: Firefighter
Nicholas Borrillo, first grade, Ladder 1.
CHIEF CONGIUSTA: Of the Fire
Department of the City of New York. We are
at the quarters of Ladder 1, regarding the
events of September 11th, 2001.
Q. Go ahead, Nick. Tell your story.
A. We were at a box for odor of gas in the
street on Church and Lispenard. We were
investigating that. We were just about ready to
take up from that box and come back when we heard
the roar of the engines of the plane. Before we
knew it, it was overhead. Within two seconds it
hit the north tower.
We all jumped on the rig. It was
Ladder 1, Engine 7, Battalion 1, Ladder 8, Engine
55, if I'm not mistaken. We headed down Canal
Street to the west side. Then we headed town to the Trade Center. We pulled up in front of the
Trade Center on West Street on the east side
right in front of the building. There's a bus
stop right in front of the building. We were
right there.
We got off the rig. We kind of
gathered ourselves a little bit, discussed what
we were going to do.
Q. Where did you park the rig?
A. The rig was parked on West Street
facing north, right in front of the building. As
I said, there was a bus stop that was right
there. We parked a little bit north of the bus
stop, probably by that big overhang.
Q. Okay. Right at the bridge that goes
across West Street.
A. After that.
Q. It's not after that?
A. There was a big overhang when you walk
into the tower. There's an overhang on that part
of the building.
We went to the fire command station.
We waited for some orders. Chief Pfeifer was in
charge of the fire at that time. We were trying to find out if we were going to get our Port
Authority radio that we normally get. Those
never came.
We tried to get information about the
elevators. That took a little bit of time. I
don't know how long it might have taken, but
before we actually knew that, we didn't have any
elevators and they said start making your way up.
We started going up. We went to the B
staircase. There were lots of civilians coming
down that particular staircase. It was a few
minutes even before we were able to clear out
enough space where we could see to start going
up.
Maybe on the second floor I thought I
heard a little bit of an explosion or something.
Later on we found out that there was a -- there
was a Port Authority guy on the staircase in our
vicinity. He confirmed that another plane had
hit the other tower.
We still kept going up. It was a slow
go going up. It was really congested. We were
single file going up. The civilians were single
file coming down. We were just telling people just to stay calm, just get out of the building,
the best way you can.
We were getting a little separated from
each other. We tried to just keep with each
other, just in case there was anything -- we
didn't want to have to look for anyone on the way
out.
A couple guys were behind us, so we had
to stop maybe two times as we were going up. We
climbed up to the 23rd floor. We were waiting
for a couple of our guys to come up. They
finally hooked up with us, and we took a break.
There was a water display thing like for sodas
and everything. We got into that, because we
were just overheating. We took, I don't know, a
five-minute break there.
Then we heard a rumble. We heard it
and we felt the whole building shake. It was
like being on a train, being in an earthquake. A
train is more like it, because with the train you
hear the rumbling, and it kind of like moved you
around in the hall. Then it just stopped after
eight or ten seconds, about the time it took for
the building to come down.
We just kind of looked at each other
like what the hell was that? Then it stopped. I
had left my mask, my helmet, my jacket down the
hallway. I said, no, I might need that, let me
go back and get it. I ran back and got that. A
couple minutes later, not that I heard on my
radio. I didn't hear the evacuation order over
my radio, but there was a chief from the 11th
Division, I believe, Picciotto.
Q. From the 11th Battalion.
A. The 11th Battalion.
He was probably coming down from like
30 or something like that. He was telling
everybody directly to leave the building. So we
got our stuff, we started going down. There were
still civilians in the staircase. We probably
got to the civilians around the 10th floor. So
we kind of slowed down a little bit. We didn't
want to panic them.
We really didn't know what was going
on. We didn't know the whole building fell down.
We just didn't know that. Maybe if we did, maybe
we would have made it a little more urgent. It
was really pretty calm in the staircase. Nobody was yelling or screaming. The civilians were
fine.
We got down. I don't know how long it
took us to get down, maybe 20 minutes. About
that time we came down, we got down to the lobby,
walked towards West Street. We figured we would
go back to the fire command station. There was
nobody at that fire command station.
I waited for one of the other guys,
Steve Olsen, to come down. He was about two
minutes behind me. We walked down to the West
Street side where our rig was. As I said before,
I spoke to him for 10 or 15 seconds. We were
looking up at the building. We were like, how
are we going to fight this one? Let's regroup
and walk north. I said, "Joe, are you coming
with us?" He said, "I'll be right there."
Me and Steve got to about -- walking
north on West, we got to maybe half a block to a
block north of Vesey when the north tower fell.
We just hauled. We were running. There were a
bunch us running. I actually got up around two
blocks.
The dust cloud was right behind me. It overcame me a little bit. I got up to Stuyvesant
High School. I ducked into the school, rested
there for two or three minutes, came back
outside, walked on the sidewalk back down. I
didn't know where Steve Olsen was, and I didn't
know -- (inaudible).
I asked where they were. Everybody
else was with him. He said everybody else was
with him, the officer and three other members.
We sat up a rendezvous point. I think it was
Harrison Street, maybe, Harrison and West. We
kind of regrouped right there.
After that we scattered up and got back
to the firehouse. We had no masks. Some guys
didn't have their coat on. Some guys didn't have
their helmet. We said, let's go back to the
firehouse, let's get our second gear and then
we'll get back down to the Trade Center. We had
no tanks or anything.
That's it.
https://static01.nyt.com/packages/pdf/nyregion/20050812_WTC_GRAPHIC/9110426.PDF
MR. DUN: Today's date is November 1, 2001. The time is 10:20 a.m. I am Richard Dun in the New York City Fire Department working with.
Q. Fabiola?
A. Quevedo, of the New York City Fire Department.
Q. We are conducting an interview with --
A. Gregg Brady Battalion 4, EMT D.
Q. Gregg, in your own words and description please describe the events of September 11, 2001 this year.
A. Okay. I reported to work normally as I do, reported in at 8 a.m. At the time of the first crash, I was sitting in our office speaking with the ALS coordinator of Division 1, Esther Coarse, when we heard a loud bang, we both thought it was a sanitation truck, either dropped something or they crashed. Never thinking it was a plane.
At that time, we heard a lot of talking on the radio and I got a call from Captain Mark Stone saying to load up vehicle 849, a Suburban, and be waiting for him downstairs. As he arrived, we proceeded down to the north tower of World Trade Center. As we were proceeding through the Battery Park tunnel, as we came out, we saw the second plane hit the south tower. At that time, traffic was very dense and it was very hard to get through.
Q. Was it dense because there was debris on the ground yet?
A. Yes, there was a lot of debris on the ground. There was a lot of people looking up, watching, a lot of people not knowing what to do.
Q. Was it chaotic or anything like that?
A. Yes. Very chaotic, people, they were evacuating busses and stuff like that. I managed to make my way through and I parked vehicle 849 across the street -- across from the south tower on the West Side Highway. At that time, me and Captain Stone met up with Chief Gombo, and Chief Gombo and Captain Stone proceeded on talking on what courses of action that we should take.
After meeting -- after their meeting, Captain Stone proceeded to ask me to instruct 3 units to follow us into the north tower's lobby and set up a triage area. At the time, as we were going through, it was very chaotic. A lot of jumpers. Had a body laying about 20 feet to my right.
Q. Were the radios working at that time?
A. At that time radios were working, cell phones we were having a lot of trouble with. We proceeded through a broken window that the Fire Department broke to lead access into the south tower. We proceeded to set up a triage area. At that time plans changed and we transferred the triage area over to 7 World Trade Center, in the lobby.
From that time, I proceeded with Captain Stone back into the south tower to meet up with Chief Gombo again. Chief Gombo proceeded outside, so we went outside and I found myself standing underneath the south tower.
Exact place, I believe, was across the street near a toll booth. I remember a toll booth. At that time, as they were speaking we heard a loud rumble and we look up and we saw that the south tower was coming down. We all turned around to go run and all we saw was a building. I pretty much thought I was dead. I didn't see anywhere else to run. Although we saw a bunch of firemen running into an underground parking garage, so seeing that, I followed them into the underground parking garage and huddled against the wall waiting for the debris to come in.
Q. Was Captain Stone in
A. Yes, Captain Stone proceeded in. At that time, we lost each other. After all the debris stopped from coming in, I turned around and I couldn't even see my hand in front of my face. I had no clue where I was, I was breathing a lot of dust and concrete dust. It and was all globbing up in my mouth and I tried to spit it out and a bunch of firefighters turned on flashlights and started yelling come towards the light.
We found an exit, the way out. We found an exit, the way out. We came out a side exit. Came out through a stairwell, a side exit of a stairwell on the bottom floor. Came around and proceeded around to the front of the second building. Actually
Q. The first tower?
A. The first tower. We were standing right over here.
Q. The parking lot and the driveway is over here.
A. There is an underground parking lot somewhere over here, right?
Q. Right here.
A. Okay. So we ran over here.
Q. You came out in the Financial Center?
A. Yes, we ran underneath 2 World Financial Center and we came out in front. I don't know how we came out. There must have been a side exit out. When we came out in front it was just as dark as it was out there. You know, we came outside and I thought -- I didn't even know we were outside it was just as dark as it was inside.
From there, at that time I still lost Captain Stone, I hadn't seen him. I met up with Chief Carrasquillo. I met up with him outside. I know him from being Chief Ianarelli's aide. I met up with him. We proceeded to 3 World Financial Center, the American Express building and we -- they set up a plan of action. They set up a triage area in that lobby.
Plans changed again. I met up with -- I saw Captain Stone in that lobby. They moved the triage area to -- I'm not sure what the building is called.
Q. North End Avenue?
A. North End Avenue and Vesey Street, there is a building right on the corner. At that time we proceeded into the middle of West Street directly underneath the north tower. At that time, I had a very tight feeling in my stomach, just experiencing what I went through with 2 World Trade Center, being that close. I didn't feel at ease at all.
We were standing underneath and Captain Stone was speaking again. We heard -- I heard 3 loud explosions. I look up and the north tower is coming down now, 1 World Trade Center.
Q. Did you see any fire Chiefs or anybody like that?
A. I saw two fire Chiefs. I don't recall their names. I saw two fire Chiefs, Chief Basile, Captain Stone and I don't recall who else was over there. We were standing in a circle in the middle of West Street. They were talking about what was going on.
At that time, when I heard the 3 loud explosions, I started running west on Vesey Street towards the water. At that time, I couldn't run fast enough. The debris caught up with me, knocked my helmet off. I tumbled and then eventually I started running again. I made it behind a building on North End Avenue. I set up a triage area in that corner building and at that time I started treating patients.
I was standing around and I saw a whole bunch of patients coming in. I started treating -- I do remember treating a 3 star Chief from the Fire Department. He was on a backboard and we put oxygen on him, we are bringing in equipment. They were setting up ambulances outside to get them out. Was treating regular pedestrians, regular civilians.
Q. Was there a lot of chaos at that time?
A. A lot of chaos. Inside the building was Chief Gombo, Chief Pascale, Chief Basile, Captain Stone and a Lieutenant that I'm not sure -- I don't recall his name, from EMS. They were talking over a strategy of what else was going to happen, what they should do. At that time I left and I started treating patients again.
After that, I left with Captain Stone to the West Side -- we left to go to the West Side Highway. I'm not exactly sure why or
Q. Did you happen to go north or south?
A. We went north on the West Side Highway, after they talked about what strategy. We started walking towards Chelsea Piers, because they set up a triage area up there. From what I remember, Captain Stone was injured during the second tower coming down, and we met up with Chief Randy Hirth and Lieutenant Grace Cacciola, and Captain Stone was transported to Bellevue for an x-ray on his shoulder. After he was released, we returned to Battalion 8 for about 20 minutes and we proceeded back down to Ground Zero.
After that, we were -- I'm not sure. I believe we went up to Chelsea Piers and we started --
Q. With Chief Hirth?
A. With Chief Hirth, Grace Cacciola and Captain Mark Stone.
Q. So Mark came back?
A. Yes, Mark came back.
Q. You all went back to Chelsea Piers and that's where you stayed the rest of the tour or the remainder?
A. We stayed up there for maybe I would say maybe half an hour, 40 minutes, then we proceeded back down to West and Chambers where they set up the command post for EMS, where Captain Stone met up with Chief Basile again, Chief Carrasquillo, Chief Pascale and Chief McCracken. They started laying out the plan for --
Q. Long term operations?
A. Yes. For long term operations and from there I met up with Chief Steffens. At that time I was acting as his aide because Chief Ianarelli is out on medical at this moment. We were instructed to head up to Chelsea Piers and Chief Steffens was to take command of Chelsea Piers. At that time, I acted as his aide, recovering information as well.
Q. Okay. So that's --
A. That's basically my experience.
MR. DUN: Okay. This concludes the interview. The time is 1030 hours.
https://static01.nyt.com/packages/pdf/nyregion/20050812_WTC_GRAPHIC/9110184.PDF
CHIEF KENAHAN: Today's date is December 12th, 2001. The time is 3:17 p.m. This is Battalion Chief Dennis Kenahan of the Safety Battalion of the Fire Department of the City of New York. I'm conducting an interview with John Breen, firefighter fourth grade from Engine 74. The interview is taking place in the quarters of Engine 74.
Q. John, just tell us the events of September 11th.
A. On that morning we got the run -- after the second building was hit, that's when we got the run. It was after 9:00. It came over the voice alarm. The whole battalion was called to go. us, 25 Truck, 47 Engine, 76 and 22 and 35 and 40 I believe were the companies that I heard over the voice alarm to respond.
We went down the West Side Highway. We had a clear go all the way down. It was no problem as far as traffic going down that way. We pulled up on the West Side Highway. We were on West Street. Where we parked I believe was Vesey Street. I probably will tell you about that later on. I'm almost positive it was Vesey Street where we parked our rig.
As we parked there, one of the other trucks I noticed that was there was 25 Truck. I believe Joe Collins from 25 Truck. I believe that was who he was. He was riding extra for 25. I heard he was supposed to go to a detail to 76 and 22.
I was just talking to one of the details that's working here today. He's from 25. He said Joe Collins was riding extra. He came over to our rig, and he was asking for a mask, and he was given our chauffeur's mask.
Myself, Lieutenant Nichols, Jeff Johnson, Pat Carey and Ruben Correa were walking down West Side to West Street underneath the pedestrian bridge. We were walking towards the Marriott Hotel. I was told by Lieutenant Nichols that dispatch called him over the radio and we were told to report to the Marriott Hotel, the old Vista Hotel, which is Three World Trade Center.
As we were walking underneath, we didn't see any bodies falling out. We did see one body on the ground, and that's when the lieutenant told us to walk as far away from the building as we could and just to keep our heads up for any falling bodies.
We walked into the lobby of the Marriott. The only other company I saw that I knew down there at the time that I know was 47 Engine. The chief that was working there that morning, I wish I knew who he was -- I really don't know -- at the command center. I really don't know what his name was, but he was telling us to -- the engines to line up on one side and the trucks on the other side.
We were told first we were going to go into the south tower. Then there was a report of people stuck or possible hotel guests still up in the Marriott. A couple of units were told to go up there.
The companies I do know that went up there with us is 74 Engine, 54 Engine, 11 Truck and I believe, but I am not positive, 23 Engine. We were told to go up to the 22nd floor. We took the elevator up to the 18th floor. We walked up four flights of stairs to the top floor.
Up on the top floor, it was a pool, spa, gym equipment, saunas. It was just a workout area and a spa area with a couple of office spaces. We did see part of -- I didn't see it, but Jeff Johnson told me later on he did see part of the landing gear actually fell right through the roof and it was in one of the Jacuzzis in another room.
There was nobody up there. We did a search up there. There was no fire up there either, no bodies to report. We were going to take an elevator down. I don't believe there was an elevator on 22. We walked down one flight.
We went down the south stairwell. We walked it down one flight to the 21st floor. We went to the elevator, which is more -- from the south stairwell, we walked a little bit north down the hallway, waiting for the elevator. There was about 20 of us. Again, this was 54 Engine, 74, 11 Truck and I believe 23 Engine.
As we were waiting for the elevator to take us down, it was running a little too slow or stuck on one of the floors. My lieutenant, Lieutenant Nichols, said we're better off walking down. We were going to go down I believe to the lobby, and I think we were going to go to the south tower, which is I believe connected, somehow connected to the Marriott.
We started walking down the hallway towards the south stairwell. It was my company that was leading the way. Pat Carey I believe was in front, Jeff Johnson, Lieutenant Nichols, myself, Ruben Correa, then the other companies.
As we were walking, that's when the south tower came down. Pretty much we just stood where we were. There was nowhere we could go. We were just stuck in this hallway.
Pretty much when all was said and done, we gathered ourselves. We were doing a head count as far as my company, and we noticed that we were calling for Ruben and Ruben was behind me in the hallway. Him and the other companies were behind us. I was about ten feet away in the hallway from being one of the missing. As far as we turned around and we looked, that side of the hallway was all covered in debris and rubble. All the lights were out. There were no lights. We had to use flashlights.
So it was just basically four of us that got out. The chauffeur, by the way, was back at the rig. The chauffeur did not go with us. He was back at the rig. That was Mike Shagi. I forgot to mention that earlier.
So pretty much at this point it was the three companies I just mentioned and Ruben Correa that was trapped. It was about 16 guys, roughly. There was about four of us that were still on that floor.
We called a mayday. We couldn't hear anything. Nobody responded. We didn't know what was going on. We didn't even know that the whole building came down. We called a mayday. We couldn't hear anything. However, we did hear one mayday, and I believe it was from 4 Truck, one of the members from 4 Truck. His mayday was given. He didn't know what floor he was on. He was just saying that he was with 4 Truck, he was running out of air, please come get him.
We couldn't do anything at that point. We just were trying to get out to guys that we had. We were trying to find a void. We started moving some of the rubble pieces. We couldn't find anything and started yelling. We called for guys' names and tried to listen for any names. We couldn't hear anything.
We walked a floor down below, which is the 20th floor, and there was more rubble that way. Basically we saw, okay, we're trapped inside of all this debris. There were two floors of rubble. My lieutenant made the decision at that point for us we have to get out, try to get some help, especially for the guys trapped and for the guy who was calling the mayday for 4 Truck.
We went down the south stairwell. We met up with members from 12 Truck, and there were some other members. I don't remember who they were. When we went down, there were about ten members in all that we met up with.
We got down to about the sixth floor. They were in one of the hotel suites. I believe it was the presidential suite. I heard later on that's what it was. This was on the sixth floor. I heard it was looking out -- later on Jeff Johnson -- I'm only going by what he said. I don't know what we were looking at outside this suite. There was a whole section of the building that was gone. I was told later on that that was West Street that it was out looking over.
Basically the bottom line was we were going to lower ourselves down by rope because we heard from 12 Truck that they couldn't go any further down the stairwell. This is on the sixth floor of the south stairwell we went down. They were going to lower themselves by rope.
I told them we passed some roof rope on the way down. A couple guys went up to get it. We even breached a wall, and me and Pat Carey were tying off two and a half lengths. We were going to even use some of the rollups to lower ourselves down.
My officer said this is just too dangerous, it's too unstable to do this. He made the decision to try to do something. Him and the senior man felt that they could do something as far as maybe there's a way to get down the stairwell that we overlooked.
It was a good thing we did, because when we went down the stairwell, we went down about a floor or a half landing, and Jeff Johnson hopped over one of the railings, started moving sheetrock. It was just lightweight sheetrock. It wasn't nothing heavy-duty or extra heavy or anything like that. It was just basic lightweight sheetrock. He started moving it out of the way.
He went down to about the fifth or the fourth floor landing or the fourth floor. He yelled back up that there were some people down there. There were some civilians. We were later on told that they worked with The New York Times or Time magazine. We still don't know what it was. There were five businessmen, all men. To this day I still don't even know who they are. I tried to contact the, and tried through New York Times, but I got no response.
Basically everybody else at that point started following us down, just started coming one after another, started going down the stairwell.
I heard later on -- in fact, I went to his memorial service. I heard a couple of guys from 12 Truck made the decision to go back up and see if they could help out the mayday from 4 Truck. I heard one of them was Mike Mullan, the lieutenant, and I think a rotating fireman. I wish I knew his name, but I don't. But I heard that they made the decision to go back up to try to help out the mayday.
We made our way down to about the third floor, the rest of us. It was maybe about ten in all, probably about like four of us from 74 and maybe six from 12 truck and a few others from -- I don't know what other company it was. I still don't know to this day.
We got down to about the third floor with also the five businessmen. I think we were facing east at that point. I would say we were facing east or maybe north. I'm just looking at the way the building was shaped right here. It might have been the north section of the building, facing north or east, either way.
When we got down there, Jeff Johnson and Pat Carey hopped out. There was more or less like a little patio about half a story down that they hopped out on. There was a lightweight beam that they situated where we could get these civilians down.
Either way, you could slide down this beam or you could go down the other half landing and hop over. This is as far as we can go, because this whole section of the third floor was still open like that. This was a big opening to get outside.
I was staying back. I wanted to feel like I was doing something. I was helping out these civilians, making sure that they got down the beam, that they slid down the beam okay.
It got to a point where everybody was starting to get out. It was me, two more civilians left and maybe two guys I believe from 12 Truck that were still in there waiting to get out, and that's when the north tower started to come down. We just kind of stood and braced where we were.
One of the civilians with me was about 80 years old. As the building was coming down, I was yelling to see if he was still there. He said he was. I held his hand just to make sure we were together in case we were trapped.
When the dust settled, the hole was open and we were lucky enough that that happened. Everybody was pretty much scattered all over the place. My lieutenant was in front of me. That half landing or patio that he was on where the beam was situated, he was down there. He was a little bit trapped, but he was able to get out. There was all kinds of rubble all around him. He was very lucky that he was alive. It was sort of like a bunker that he was in. It was just all debris around him. He was able to squeeze his way out of that.
Two of the brothers from 12 Truck, they were okay, and the two civilians were okay. I heard Jeff Johnson yelling -- I found out later on that he had gone to the second floor. There was a way to get in there. There was some kind of a sliding door.
He had gone around a corner of the building, which I believe would have been the south side or possibly the east side of the building. I'm really not positive. He had gotten down to the second floor and hid behind a beam. He was with three of the civilians in that hallway.
Pat Carey, he was yelling for Pat. I didn't know where Pat was either. I thought Pat was gone. Somehow he had gotten down to the second floor, but he lost contact with us. He didn't have a radio. We had lost him. I thought he was gone.
I got out. I was helping the civilians down. Once we got out, Lieutenant Nichols got himself out. At that point I was yelling for Pat. I was yelling and yelling. At this point we knew we couldn't even do a mayday. We were just trying to get ourselves out. Myself and the lieutenant and the two other guys from 12 Truck, we helped the two civilians out. We walked them out.
By the way, at this point I don't know what happened to the other members. I think and I hoped that they did -- I'm pretty sure that they did because I met up with 12 Truck. All of their guys got out. I heard later on that the only guys that didn't get out -- all the guys that survived the first collapse, the only ones that didn't get out was Mike Mullan, the officer, and the rotator that went up to respond to the mayday. I heard later on that they got out. Somehow they went the wrong way.
So the only ones at that point that I saw visibly get out was myself, Lieutenant Nichols, the two civilians and then the two guys from 12 Truck. Jeff Johnson, I thought he had gone around another direction and got the three civilians out another way, because I did hear his voice but I heard he was okay.
Although he was on the second floor, I didn't know at the time he was where he was. But he was pretty much stuck on the second floor. I thought he had gone out through another section of the building and walked out.
That's how confusing it was. Everybody pretty much was just trying to get out and walk their own way. As far as me, I heard Jeff's voice, and the lieutenant said he was okay. So I knew Jeff enough to be a senior man, I knew he was okay. The only ones that I was really worried about at that point that I knew was missing was Pat Carey. So I yelled and called his name.
We couldn't do anything at that point, so we started walking out. I believe we were in the atrium? Is this called the atrium?
Q. I'm not sure.
A. I believe we were walking in the atrium. I think we were walking towards Two World Trade Center. The south tower, I think we were walking pretty much among the rubble and everything there. I think we got out and walked out on Liberty Street.
As we were walking among the debris of the fallen building, a couple guys from rescue came over. They helped us with the two civilians. I told them that there were missing members. I pointed to the Marriott. I told them basically that on the 21st floor, it was the first collapse.
We had the three companies plus Reuben, where they were trapped. But it was useless by that point because the floor wasn't even there. There was only about four stories to that building left.
The other one I talked about was Pat Carey. I said I saw him last on the third floor of the Marriott. It ended up that Pat got out okay. He was trapped on the second floor. He was actually separated from Jeff and everybody else, and he actually jumped out, found an opening and jumped out, and actually fractured his coccyx bone and has several herniated disks.
Jeff Johnson made it out too. Although I didn't know at the time, I thought he was out, but he was still stuck on the second floor with the three civilians. He made his way out another way. They kind of finagled their way down and they got out okay.
From there, me and the lieutenant basically just walked towards the park. What's the name of that park? Battery Park. That's where I met Jeff. Basically we were calling for Mike Shagi. We found out later on when he was running he was getting short breath and everything like that, and he went to the hospital for some air, to be treated. We found out he was okay later on.
As I mentioned before, we were on Vesey Street when we were out where the park was. We were walking on some of the south streets, I guess Albany Street or Carlisle, one of those streets. We kind of made our way up Trinity or Church, and then we kind of made our way down to Vesey. That's when we found our rig over there. Our rig was parked on Vesey.
I still don't know all the companies that were with us that we ran into in after the second collapse. But as far as I know, the companies that we did meet up with was 11 Truck, 54 Engine and I'm pretty sure it was 23 Engine.
Q. That's it, John?
A. That's it.
Q. Thanks for all your help, John.
CHIEF KENAHAN: The time now is 3:38, and this concludes the interview.
https://static01.nyt.com/packages/pdf/nyregion/20050812_WTC_GRAPHIC/9110321.PDF
File No. 9110184
WORLD TRADE CENTER
TASK FORCE INTERVIEW
EMT GREGG BRADY
Interview Date: November 1, 2001
Transcribed by Elisabeth F. Nason
MR. DUN: Today's date is November 1, 2001. The time is 10:20 a.m. I am Richard Dun in the New York City Fire Department working with.
Q. Fabiola?
A. Quevedo, of the New York City Fire Department.
Q. We are conducting an interview with --
A. Gregg Brady Battalion 4, EMT D.
Q. Gregg, in your own words and description please describe the events of September 11, 2001 this year.
A. Okay. I reported to work normally as I do, reported in at 8 a.m. At the time of the first crash, I was sitting in our office speaking with the ALS coordinator of Division 1, Esther Coarse, when we heard a loud bang, we both thought it was a sanitation truck, either dropped something or they crashed. Never thinking it was a plane.
At that time, we heard a lot of talking on the radio and I got a call from Captain Mark Stone saying to load up vehicle 849, a Suburban, and be waiting for him downstairs. As he arrived, we proceeded down to the north tower of World Trade Center. As we were proceeding through the Battery Park tunnel, as we came out, we saw the second plane hit the south tower. At that time, traffic was very dense and it was very hard to get through.
Q. Was it dense because there was debris on the ground yet?
A. Yes, there was a lot of debris on the ground. There was a lot of people looking up, watching, a lot of people not knowing what to do.
Q. Was it chaotic or anything like that?
A. Yes. Very chaotic, people, they were evacuating busses and stuff like that. I managed to make my way through and I parked vehicle 849 across the street -- across from the south tower on the West Side Highway. At that time, me and Captain Stone met up with Chief Gombo, and Chief Gombo and Captain Stone proceeded on talking on what courses of action that we should take.
After meeting -- after their meeting, Captain Stone proceeded to ask me to instruct 3 units to follow us into the north tower's lobby and set up a triage area. At the time, as we were going through, it was very chaotic. A lot of jumpers. Had a body laying about 20 feet to my right.
Q. Were the radios working at that time?
A. At that time radios were working, cell phones we were having a lot of trouble with. We proceeded through a broken window that the Fire Department broke to lead access into the south tower. We proceeded to set up a triage area. At that time plans changed and we transferred the triage area over to 7 World Trade Center, in the lobby.
From that time, I proceeded with Captain Stone back into the south tower to meet up with Chief Gombo again. Chief Gombo proceeded outside, so we went outside and I found myself standing underneath the south tower.
Exact place, I believe, was across the street near a toll booth. I remember a toll booth. At that time, as they were speaking we heard a loud rumble and we look up and we saw that the south tower was coming down. We all turned around to go run and all we saw was a building. I pretty much thought I was dead. I didn't see anywhere else to run. Although we saw a bunch of firemen running into an underground parking garage, so seeing that, I followed them into the underground parking garage and huddled against the wall waiting for the debris to come in.
Q. Was Captain Stone in
A. Yes, Captain Stone proceeded in. At that time, we lost each other. After all the debris stopped from coming in, I turned around and I couldn't even see my hand in front of my face. I had no clue where I was, I was breathing a lot of dust and concrete dust. It and was all globbing up in my mouth and I tried to spit it out and a bunch of firefighters turned on flashlights and started yelling come towards the light.
We found an exit, the way out. We found an exit, the way out. We came out a side exit. Came out through a stairwell, a side exit of a stairwell on the bottom floor. Came around and proceeded around to the front of the second building. Actually
Q. The first tower?
A. The first tower. We were standing right over here.
Q. The parking lot and the driveway is over here.
A. There is an underground parking lot somewhere over here, right?
Q. Right here.
A. Okay. So we ran over here.
Q. You came out in the Financial Center?
A. Yes, we ran underneath 2 World Financial Center and we came out in front. I don't know how we came out. There must have been a side exit out. When we came out in front it was just as dark as it was out there. You know, we came outside and I thought -- I didn't even know we were outside it was just as dark as it was inside.
From there, at that time I still lost Captain Stone, I hadn't seen him. I met up with Chief Carrasquillo. I met up with him outside. I know him from being Chief Ianarelli's aide. I met up with him. We proceeded to 3 World Financial Center, the American Express building and we -- they set up a plan of action. They set up a triage area in that lobby.
Plans changed again. I met up with -- I saw Captain Stone in that lobby. They moved the triage area to -- I'm not sure what the building is called.
Q. North End Avenue?
A. North End Avenue and Vesey Street, there is a building right on the corner. At that time we proceeded into the middle of West Street directly underneath the north tower. At that time, I had a very tight feeling in my stomach, just experiencing what I went through with 2 World Trade Center, being that close. I didn't feel at ease at all.
We were standing underneath and Captain Stone was speaking again. We heard -- I heard 3 loud explosions. I look up and the north tower is coming down now, 1 World Trade Center.
Q. Did you see any fire Chiefs or anybody like that?
A. I saw two fire Chiefs. I don't recall their names. I saw two fire Chiefs, Chief Basile, Captain Stone and I don't recall who else was over there. We were standing in a circle in the middle of West Street. They were talking about what was going on.
At that time, when I heard the 3 loud explosions, I started running west on Vesey Street towards the water. At that time, I couldn't run fast enough. The debris caught up with me, knocked my helmet off. I tumbled and then eventually I started running again. I made it behind a building on North End Avenue. I set up a triage area in that corner building and at that time I started treating patients.
I was standing around and I saw a whole bunch of patients coming in. I started treating -- I do remember treating a 3 star Chief from the Fire Department. He was on a backboard and we put oxygen on him, we are bringing in equipment. They were setting up ambulances outside to get them out. Was treating regular pedestrians, regular civilians.
Q. Was there a lot of chaos at that time?
A. A lot of chaos. Inside the building was Chief Gombo, Chief Pascale, Chief Basile, Captain Stone and a Lieutenant that I'm not sure -- I don't recall his name, from EMS. They were talking over a strategy of what else was going to happen, what they should do. At that time I left and I started treating patients again.
After that, I left with Captain Stone to the West Side -- we left to go to the West Side Highway. I'm not exactly sure why or
Q. Did you happen to go north or south?
A. We went north on the West Side Highway, after they talked about what strategy. We started walking towards Chelsea Piers, because they set up a triage area up there. From what I remember, Captain Stone was injured during the second tower coming down, and we met up with Chief Randy Hirth and Lieutenant Grace Cacciola, and Captain Stone was transported to Bellevue for an x-ray on his shoulder. After he was released, we returned to Battalion 8 for about 20 minutes and we proceeded back down to Ground Zero.
After that, we were -- I'm not sure. I believe we went up to Chelsea Piers and we started --
Q. With Chief Hirth?
A. With Chief Hirth, Grace Cacciola and Captain Mark Stone.
Q. So Mark came back?
A. Yes, Mark came back.
Q. You all went back to Chelsea Piers and that's where you stayed the rest of the tour or the remainder?
A. We stayed up there for maybe I would say maybe half an hour, 40 minutes, then we proceeded back down to West and Chambers where they set up the command post for EMS, where Captain Stone met up with Chief Basile again, Chief Carrasquillo, Chief Pascale and Chief McCracken. They started laying out the plan for --
Q. Long term operations?
A. Yes. For long term operations and from there I met up with Chief Steffens. At that time I was acting as his aide because Chief Ianarelli is out on medical at this moment. We were instructed to head up to Chelsea Piers and Chief Steffens was to take command of Chelsea Piers. At that time, I acted as his aide, recovering information as well.
Q. Okay. So that's --
A. That's basically my experience.
MR. DUN: Okay. This concludes the interview. The time is 1030 hours.
https://static01.nyt.com/packages/pdf/nyregion/20050812_WTC_GRAPHIC/9110184.PDF
File No. 9110321
WORLD TRADE CENTER
TASK FORCE INTERVIEW
FIREFIGHTER JOHN BREEN
Interview Date: December 12, 2001
Transcribed by Laurie A. Collins
CHIEF KENAHAN: Today's date is December 12th, 2001. The time is 3:17 p.m. This is Battalion Chief Dennis Kenahan of the Safety Battalion of the Fire Department of the City of New York. I'm conducting an interview with John Breen, firefighter fourth grade from Engine 74. The interview is taking place in the quarters of Engine 74.
Q. John, just tell us the events of September 11th.
A. On that morning we got the run -- after the second building was hit, that's when we got the run. It was after 9:00. It came over the voice alarm. The whole battalion was called to go. us, 25 Truck, 47 Engine, 76 and 22 and 35 and 40 I believe were the companies that I heard over the voice alarm to respond.
We went down the West Side Highway. We had a clear go all the way down. It was no problem as far as traffic going down that way. We pulled up on the West Side Highway. We were on West Street. Where we parked I believe was Vesey Street. I probably will tell you about that later on. I'm almost positive it was Vesey Street where we parked our rig.
As we parked there, one of the other trucks I noticed that was there was 25 Truck. I believe Joe Collins from 25 Truck. I believe that was who he was. He was riding extra for 25. I heard he was supposed to go to a detail to 76 and 22.
I was just talking to one of the details that's working here today. He's from 25. He said Joe Collins was riding extra. He came over to our rig, and he was asking for a mask, and he was given our chauffeur's mask.
Myself, Lieutenant Nichols, Jeff Johnson, Pat Carey and Ruben Correa were walking down West Side to West Street underneath the pedestrian bridge. We were walking towards the Marriott Hotel. I was told by Lieutenant Nichols that dispatch called him over the radio and we were told to report to the Marriott Hotel, the old Vista Hotel, which is Three World Trade Center.
As we were walking underneath, we didn't see any bodies falling out. We did see one body on the ground, and that's when the lieutenant told us to walk as far away from the building as we could and just to keep our heads up for any falling bodies.
We walked into the lobby of the Marriott. The only other company I saw that I knew down there at the time that I know was 47 Engine. The chief that was working there that morning, I wish I knew who he was -- I really don't know -- at the command center. I really don't know what his name was, but he was telling us to -- the engines to line up on one side and the trucks on the other side.
We were told first we were going to go into the south tower. Then there was a report of people stuck or possible hotel guests still up in the Marriott. A couple of units were told to go up there.
The companies I do know that went up there with us is 74 Engine, 54 Engine, 11 Truck and I believe, but I am not positive, 23 Engine. We were told to go up to the 22nd floor. We took the elevator up to the 18th floor. We walked up four flights of stairs to the top floor.
Up on the top floor, it was a pool, spa, gym equipment, saunas. It was just a workout area and a spa area with a couple of office spaces. We did see part of -- I didn't see it, but Jeff Johnson told me later on he did see part of the landing gear actually fell right through the roof and it was in one of the Jacuzzis in another room.
There was nobody up there. We did a search up there. There was no fire up there either, no bodies to report. We were going to take an elevator down. I don't believe there was an elevator on 22. We walked down one flight.
We went down the south stairwell. We walked it down one flight to the 21st floor. We went to the elevator, which is more -- from the south stairwell, we walked a little bit north down the hallway, waiting for the elevator. There was about 20 of us. Again, this was 54 Engine, 74, 11 Truck and I believe 23 Engine.
As we were waiting for the elevator to take us down, it was running a little too slow or stuck on one of the floors. My lieutenant, Lieutenant Nichols, said we're better off walking down. We were going to go down I believe to the lobby, and I think we were going to go to the south tower, which is I believe connected, somehow connected to the Marriott.
We started walking down the hallway towards the south stairwell. It was my company that was leading the way. Pat Carey I believe was in front, Jeff Johnson, Lieutenant Nichols, myself, Ruben Correa, then the other companies.
As we were walking, that's when the south tower came down. Pretty much we just stood where we were. There was nowhere we could go. We were just stuck in this hallway.
Pretty much when all was said and done, we gathered ourselves. We were doing a head count as far as my company, and we noticed that we were calling for Ruben and Ruben was behind me in the hallway. Him and the other companies were behind us. I was about ten feet away in the hallway from being one of the missing. As far as we turned around and we looked, that side of the hallway was all covered in debris and rubble. All the lights were out. There were no lights. We had to use flashlights.
So it was just basically four of us that got out. The chauffeur, by the way, was back at the rig. The chauffeur did not go with us. He was back at the rig. That was Mike Shagi. I forgot to mention that earlier.
So pretty much at this point it was the three companies I just mentioned and Ruben Correa that was trapped. It was about 16 guys, roughly. There was about four of us that were still on that floor.
We called a mayday. We couldn't hear anything. Nobody responded. We didn't know what was going on. We didn't even know that the whole building came down. We called a mayday. We couldn't hear anything. However, we did hear one mayday, and I believe it was from 4 Truck, one of the members from 4 Truck. His mayday was given. He didn't know what floor he was on. He was just saying that he was with 4 Truck, he was running out of air, please come get him.
We couldn't do anything at that point. We just were trying to get out to guys that we had. We were trying to find a void. We started moving some of the rubble pieces. We couldn't find anything and started yelling. We called for guys' names and tried to listen for any names. We couldn't hear anything.
We walked a floor down below, which is the 20th floor, and there was more rubble that way. Basically we saw, okay, we're trapped inside of all this debris. There were two floors of rubble. My lieutenant made the decision at that point for us we have to get out, try to get some help, especially for the guys trapped and for the guy who was calling the mayday for 4 Truck.
We went down the south stairwell. We met up with members from 12 Truck, and there were some other members. I don't remember who they were. When we went down, there were about ten members in all that we met up with.
We got down to about the sixth floor. They were in one of the hotel suites. I believe it was the presidential suite. I heard later on that's what it was. This was on the sixth floor. I heard it was looking out -- later on Jeff Johnson -- I'm only going by what he said. I don't know what we were looking at outside this suite. There was a whole section of the building that was gone. I was told later on that that was West Street that it was out looking over.
Basically the bottom line was we were going to lower ourselves down by rope because we heard from 12 Truck that they couldn't go any further down the stairwell. This is on the sixth floor of the south stairwell we went down. They were going to lower themselves by rope.
I told them we passed some roof rope on the way down. A couple guys went up to get it. We even breached a wall, and me and Pat Carey were tying off two and a half lengths. We were going to even use some of the rollups to lower ourselves down.
My officer said this is just too dangerous, it's too unstable to do this. He made the decision to try to do something. Him and the senior man felt that they could do something as far as maybe there's a way to get down the stairwell that we overlooked.
It was a good thing we did, because when we went down the stairwell, we went down about a floor or a half landing, and Jeff Johnson hopped over one of the railings, started moving sheetrock. It was just lightweight sheetrock. It wasn't nothing heavy-duty or extra heavy or anything like that. It was just basic lightweight sheetrock. He started moving it out of the way.
He went down to about the fifth or the fourth floor landing or the fourth floor. He yelled back up that there were some people down there. There were some civilians. We were later on told that they worked with The New York Times or Time magazine. We still don't know what it was. There were five businessmen, all men. To this day I still don't even know who they are. I tried to contact the, and tried through New York Times, but I got no response.
Basically everybody else at that point started following us down, just started coming one after another, started going down the stairwell.
I heard later on -- in fact, I went to his memorial service. I heard a couple of guys from 12 Truck made the decision to go back up and see if they could help out the mayday from 4 Truck. I heard one of them was Mike Mullan, the lieutenant, and I think a rotating fireman. I wish I knew his name, but I don't. But I heard that they made the decision to go back up to try to help out the mayday.
We made our way down to about the third floor, the rest of us. It was maybe about ten in all, probably about like four of us from 74 and maybe six from 12 truck and a few others from -- I don't know what other company it was. I still don't know to this day.
We got down to about the third floor with also the five businessmen. I think we were facing east at that point. I would say we were facing east or maybe north. I'm just looking at the way the building was shaped right here. It might have been the north section of the building, facing north or east, either way.
When we got down there, Jeff Johnson and Pat Carey hopped out. There was more or less like a little patio about half a story down that they hopped out on. There was a lightweight beam that they situated where we could get these civilians down.
Either way, you could slide down this beam or you could go down the other half landing and hop over. This is as far as we can go, because this whole section of the third floor was still open like that. This was a big opening to get outside.
I was staying back. I wanted to feel like I was doing something. I was helping out these civilians, making sure that they got down the beam, that they slid down the beam okay.
It got to a point where everybody was starting to get out. It was me, two more civilians left and maybe two guys I believe from 12 Truck that were still in there waiting to get out, and that's when the north tower started to come down. We just kind of stood and braced where we were.
One of the civilians with me was about 80 years old. As the building was coming down, I was yelling to see if he was still there. He said he was. I held his hand just to make sure we were together in case we were trapped.
When the dust settled, the hole was open and we were lucky enough that that happened. Everybody was pretty much scattered all over the place. My lieutenant was in front of me. That half landing or patio that he was on where the beam was situated, he was down there. He was a little bit trapped, but he was able to get out. There was all kinds of rubble all around him. He was very lucky that he was alive. It was sort of like a bunker that he was in. It was just all debris around him. He was able to squeeze his way out of that.
Two of the brothers from 12 Truck, they were okay, and the two civilians were okay. I heard Jeff Johnson yelling -- I found out later on that he had gone to the second floor. There was a way to get in there. There was some kind of a sliding door.
He had gone around a corner of the building, which I believe would have been the south side or possibly the east side of the building. I'm really not positive. He had gotten down to the second floor and hid behind a beam. He was with three of the civilians in that hallway.
Pat Carey, he was yelling for Pat. I didn't know where Pat was either. I thought Pat was gone. Somehow he had gotten down to the second floor, but he lost contact with us. He didn't have a radio. We had lost him. I thought he was gone.
I got out. I was helping the civilians down. Once we got out, Lieutenant Nichols got himself out. At that point I was yelling for Pat. I was yelling and yelling. At this point we knew we couldn't even do a mayday. We were just trying to get ourselves out. Myself and the lieutenant and the two other guys from 12 Truck, we helped the two civilians out. We walked them out.
By the way, at this point I don't know what happened to the other members. I think and I hoped that they did -- I'm pretty sure that they did because I met up with 12 Truck. All of their guys got out. I heard later on that the only guys that didn't get out -- all the guys that survived the first collapse, the only ones that didn't get out was Mike Mullan, the officer, and the rotator that went up to respond to the mayday. I heard later on that they got out. Somehow they went the wrong way.
So the only ones at that point that I saw visibly get out was myself, Lieutenant Nichols, the two civilians and then the two guys from 12 Truck. Jeff Johnson, I thought he had gone around another direction and got the three civilians out another way, because I did hear his voice but I heard he was okay.
Although he was on the second floor, I didn't know at the time he was where he was. But he was pretty much stuck on the second floor. I thought he had gone out through another section of the building and walked out.
That's how confusing it was. Everybody pretty much was just trying to get out and walk their own way. As far as me, I heard Jeff's voice, and the lieutenant said he was okay. So I knew Jeff enough to be a senior man, I knew he was okay. The only ones that I was really worried about at that point that I knew was missing was Pat Carey. So I yelled and called his name.
We couldn't do anything at that point, so we started walking out. I believe we were in the atrium? Is this called the atrium?
Q. I'm not sure.
A. I believe we were walking in the atrium. I think we were walking towards Two World Trade Center. The south tower, I think we were walking pretty much among the rubble and everything there. I think we got out and walked out on Liberty Street.
As we were walking among the debris of the fallen building, a couple guys from rescue came over. They helped us with the two civilians. I told them that there were missing members. I pointed to the Marriott. I told them basically that on the 21st floor, it was the first collapse.
We had the three companies plus Reuben, where they were trapped. But it was useless by that point because the floor wasn't even there. There was only about four stories to that building left.
The other one I talked about was Pat Carey. I said I saw him last on the third floor of the Marriott. It ended up that Pat got out okay. He was trapped on the second floor. He was actually separated from Jeff and everybody else, and he actually jumped out, found an opening and jumped out, and actually fractured his coccyx bone and has several herniated disks.
Jeff Johnson made it out too. Although I didn't know at the time, I thought he was out, but he was still stuck on the second floor with the three civilians. He made his way out another way. They kind of finagled their way down and they got out okay.
From there, me and the lieutenant basically just walked towards the park. What's the name of that park? Battery Park. That's where I met Jeff. Basically we were calling for Mike Shagi. We found out later on when he was running he was getting short breath and everything like that, and he went to the hospital for some air, to be treated. We found out he was okay later on.
As I mentioned before, we were on Vesey Street when we were out where the park was. We were walking on some of the south streets, I guess Albany Street or Carlisle, one of those streets. We kind of made our way up Trinity or Church, and then we kind of made our way down to Vesey. That's when we found our rig over there. Our rig was parked on Vesey.
I still don't know all the companies that were with us that we ran into in after the second collapse. But as far as I know, the companies that we did meet up with was 11 Truck, 54 Engine and I'm pretty sure it was 23 Engine.
Q. That's it, John?
A. That's it.
Q. Thanks for all your help, John.
CHIEF KENAHAN: The time now is 3:38, and this concludes the interview.
https://static01.nyt.com/packages/pdf/nyregion/20050812_WTC_GRAPHIC/9110321.PDF
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